Drugs and personal responsibility
Using drugs does not absolve a person from his or her behavior.
When a person decides to use drugs, they also accept the fact that their behavior may be influenced by those drugs.
The Truth: I was in a jury pool of 400 for a high visibility murder trial here in South Carolina.
I was not on the selected jury that convicted and sentenced the three to death. The sentence was later converted to life in prison. The three abducted an innocent woman, tortured, raped and killed her. They were "on drugs" and had been drinking. Those facts combined with the race of the three was introduced during later appeals.
The S.C. Supreme Court later dismissed an appeal of Benjamin Anthony Joyner, one of three men convicted of killing University of South Carolina nursing student Barbara Lynn Bobbi Rossi in 1984.
Using drugs, including alcohol should not absolve a person or persons of personal responsibility.
In my opinion, they deserved the death penalty.
posted by Chief RZ @ 14.2.06
15 Comments:
I agree Chief. I was never into the drug scene-but I drank enough booze to float the kate Adams from Memphis to New Orleans. No doubt I screwed up more than once because of the booze but I could not let the fact that I was drunk absolve me of my misdeeds.
Chief,
I have to agree. Being under the influence of any drug, including alcohol, should not absolve anyone from the consequences of their actions. With personal liberty comes personal respnsibility.
I couldn't agree more.
I think it should be obvious to most sane people that being under the influence of drugs is no sort of defense unless someone else drugs you.
You and me differ, though on the death penalty. I believe that as a civilized society, we have no right to lower ourselves to the point where we have something in common with theocracies that gather to stone people to death for breaking their laws.
Then again, perhaps that's why I'm against the kind of brutal torture that has been going on during the Iraq war. Have you seen the pictures that were released the other day? I think it's important you should see what is going on in your name.
This kind of thing just makes me sick to my stomach.
timmah,
Good, glad we finally agree on something.
We do disagree on the death penalty. Your comparison to a theocracy is not a direct one. A theocracy is an unelected form of whatever form of government. A democracy elects representatives and the people make their own laws. We/I do not care to care and feed the like of the three individuals who raped, tortured and killed Miss Rossi. If a group of individuals wants to pay for their upkeep and insure that they will not kill again in or during an escape, then maybe. In another famous case here in SC, Donald "pee-wee" Gaskins killed again while in prison. These types of people are by their own behavior proven to be beyond help. We as a society have the right and responsibility to protect ourselves from killers. Don't try to project a feeling on this either like retribution. This is simply a case of eliminating a murderer from society so the rest of us will be free to live our lives in freedom from fear and pursue our happiness.
Now, to your new issue. I may address this in my next posting and even broadcast in other blogs. I have and will see your linked pictures. I saw some of them on Al Jazerra and in the local papers while in Iraq. After you view a few million pictures of real torture victims of communism and other theocracies like the Turks in 1915. Have you seen: http://magyartruth.blogspot.com/2006/01/revisionism.html ?
Let me know when you catch up. I have a similar discussion going on over at SA. After we establish what real torture is, then we can take a look at some grey areas.
You can sterilize it and cover it in euphamisms all you want, it's still state sanctioned murder, and while (of course) my comparison isn't a direct one, my point is that as a developed society we are supposed to be morally better than that.
The "they did it too" excuse doesen't work here. It was wrong then and it's wrong now. Just like the death penalty.
Who else uses the death penalty? Well, let's just make a quick list of the countries that do it the most.
China, the Democratic Republic of Congo, the United States and Iran are the most prolific executioners in the world. Indeed, the US is one of six countries (including also Iran, Nigeria, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and Yemen) which executes people who were under 18 years-old at the time they committed their crimes.
Doesen't it give you pause to live in a country that is on that list?
State sanctioned in the USA means that the people want it.
Not a tyrant imposing his authority on the populace. If a person or persons like those described murder an innocent girl, then they have also chosen their consequence.
In a perfect world, crimes and sin would not exist, but since the fall, Cain slew Able for no apparent reason but sin in the world. One father said basically the same thing following Columbine. If not guns, then spears, or clubs. The crime was committed because of the same state of man. On this earth, man and society have the obligation to protect themselves from extinction and death.
I like the environment here for the most part, people know if they do the crime, they will do the time, or even be executed after a trial by a jury, and then a second trial by a jury for the sentence.
And? That doesen't defend against any of the points I made, what are you saying?
"Yeah, sure execution is morally wrong, and the tool of third world nations, and sure it's been outlawed by every industrialized country save for China and America, but just over half the people want it, so it's ok"?
If they made the choice to use drugs, they have to accept the consequenses of their actions, even if that means death for crimes they committed.
The key words being personal responsibility.
Becca, Snow: I don't think anyone's arguing a point to the contrary. In fact, I don't know anyone who would say they believe otherwise, other than a defense lawyer.
timmah-- Glad we agree on personal responsibility for one's actions.
Timmah420 said, I believe that as a civilized society, we have no right to lower ourselves to the point where we have something in common with theocracies that gather to stone people to death for breaking their laws.
We also have another thing in common with theocracies - theft is illegal. You against criminalizing theft now?
Then again, perhaps that's why I'm against the kind of brutal torture that has been going on during the Iraq war. Have you seen the pictures that were released the other day? I think it's important you should see what is going on in your name.
We punished those involved. Is that "in our name" as well or don't we get credit for that?
You can sterilize it and cover it in euphamisms all you want, it's still state sanctioned murder...
"Murder" is illegally taking a life. Capital punishment is therefore not "murder".
...my point is that as a developed society we are supposed to be morally better than that.
What could be more "moral" than putting the ultimate price tag on the taking of another's life? I say that your position is immoral.
Doesen't it give you pause to live in a country that is on that list?
No. Because your list is without context.
Drugs and alcohol are no excuse whatsoever as likely the crime committed would not have been without the drug or alcohol use.
I don't even like the insanity plea. I'm sorry if you were dealt a faulty deck, but that does not change the fact that someone once living is no longer.
Death penalty? Sorry, I'm all for that too. The only instance (off the top of my head), where I might be against it is if the convicted really wanted it; then I'd want him to rot in prison.
Thank you to "likwidshoe" saving me the time of my two cents worth to "Timmah420." Torture? Please....messed up? You bet, but as "...shoe" said, "We punished those involved. Is that "in our name" as well or don't we get credit for that?"
No "...shoe" we don't get credit for that. Nothing that is done to correct wrongs (something we are always doing), is ever given credit. I find it hard to believe that with the way "timmah.." can hold onto these negatives without balancing it out with the positives. Bad and good things happen daily. If you concentrate on only the negative without flushing the system....well...the comments should make it obvious.
My country isn't perfect, but there is no better on the face of this earth.
Chief,
what did you mean by:
"I am looking into the possibility of being censored..." in your comment at my site?
BlandlyU-- I tried to link this post on Say Anything and got: "link is censored" or something like that. I didn't get it from yours, but yours is not HTML linked.
I will try again, and then try to contact google, or change servers. This is wrong and censorship.
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